Some weeks ago, I had the pleasure of being interviewed by Jessie Mannisto, Founder and Editor-in-Chief at Third Factor Magazine as well as Genspect’s editor.
I listened and really enjoyed your discussion with Jessie. So much to think about! I started watching Picard - which doesn’t relate at all, except in the fact that it has so many interesting ideas floating around and being explored by the characters.
Some highlights of your discussion for me:
Being “comfortable” being “weird” (or unusual) and what that even means - just accepting who and what we are and going on from there, which takes some confidence and security;
Doing “the right thing” or being “authentic” or living up to our values, etc. - which ultimately feels right (“comfortable?”), although it takes work!
Yet not having to always feel “comfortable” because - and this is the big one, folks - it’s perfectly normal to struggle and sometimes feel bad (especially for teens). In fact, without struggle, is there any point?
Lastly, I appreciate that many of “us” - moms with kids who are trans-identified who don’t “affirm” but love and support their kids and wish they could see they they are going down an extremely treacherous road and, most importantly, that they have a CHOICE - and our kids are “highly sensitive.” I would characterize myself and my daughter that way, although we express it very differently from each other.
Sorry for all the quote-marks. It’s difficult to convey that terms are either unclear, being used ironically in some cases, or meant to be somewhat vague.
Anyway, I can see the connection between stoicism and positive disintegration. Both offer a framework for living with the struggles of life, working through them and coming out the other end a little stronger. ❤️
Thanks for sharing all these thoughts! I really appreciate how generous you are with your comments. I do want to share that I think interviews are so tricky. When Jessie uses the word "attitude" to describe why I'm having the experience I am, I wish I'd thought to offer a different word, because to me it's not just an attitude, it's a whole new orientation. This means that it's more than "coming out the other end a little stronger." Does this make any sense? When we reorient to Life's struggles and see them as opportunities for growth and learning, and when we give up our attempts to control Life and avoid Life's inevitable pain--we open ourselves up to a whole new way of Living. Frameworks like stoicism and TPD can certainly help to get us there. It's when we embody our understanding of those frameworks that we really get to experience the benefits. I can't help but recognize how many different ways humans have described these "dark nights of the soul" as initiations into radical transformation. Almost like it's built into our very nature...
Thanks for this opportunity to dig in even a little deeper!
Was thinking of you as I was reading Lisa's post. 🙂
I've often thought that a simple nature-nurture dichotomy -- a binary -- was only part of the picture, that we're all somewhat more than the sum of our parts, more than just our biological inheritance or what society has dictated to us. That that binary is anything but "exhaustive". Sort of like the binary of male and female not being exhaustive, that there are many members of many anisogamous species, including the human one, who are neither, who are sexless ... 😉🙂
BTW, I see you read Singal-Minded but not sure if you have a subscription. Apparently I have 3 free ones to give out if you're interested and don't have one. Anyone else for that matter too.
Also, you might check out that thread with Ms. M as her post on Scientific American more or less precipitated our conversation on my Substack. I've just linked it there in case you wanted to weigh-in or add any qualifications ... 😉🙂:
I do not have a subscription and would happily take a free one to Singal-Minded. Thanks. I read your exchange with Ms.M, who had pretty much the same goals as me and I do see your consistent answer now. Just use genitalia or DNA or some other markers instead, as appropriate. I agree. (I didn’t weigh in there as I don’t yet subscribe to that substack.)
Follow-up from my previous comment, my brief conversation with Ms. M on Goya's Sleep of Reason -- something that should be of particular interest to you, given your "searching for reason in an insane world" 🙂:
De nada, though I'll need your email address to complete the gift. I think you subscribe to my Substack and our list of subscribers provides those but I don't see one that I'd recognize as yours. As I subscribe to your Substack you can either email me directly or let me know the first part of yours here or elsewhere if you're subscribed. Though the gift is just for a month but still some useful subscriber benefits.
En passant, Ms. M's Substack is apparently free to subscribe to and well worth doing so -- many posts you'd probably find useful:
Seem to recollect that she and I had discussed Goya's Sleep of Reason as she had linked to a post that featured his painting, although I can't find it at the moment:
Looking forward to listening to this. I appreciate the TPD and think it explains a lot.
I always appreciate your thoughts if you feel inclined to return and share them! ;)
I listened and really enjoyed your discussion with Jessie. So much to think about! I started watching Picard - which doesn’t relate at all, except in the fact that it has so many interesting ideas floating around and being explored by the characters.
Some highlights of your discussion for me:
Being “comfortable” being “weird” (or unusual) and what that even means - just accepting who and what we are and going on from there, which takes some confidence and security;
Doing “the right thing” or being “authentic” or living up to our values, etc. - which ultimately feels right (“comfortable?”), although it takes work!
Yet not having to always feel “comfortable” because - and this is the big one, folks - it’s perfectly normal to struggle and sometimes feel bad (especially for teens). In fact, without struggle, is there any point?
Lastly, I appreciate that many of “us” - moms with kids who are trans-identified who don’t “affirm” but love and support their kids and wish they could see they they are going down an extremely treacherous road and, most importantly, that they have a CHOICE - and our kids are “highly sensitive.” I would characterize myself and my daughter that way, although we express it very differently from each other.
Sorry for all the quote-marks. It’s difficult to convey that terms are either unclear, being used ironically in some cases, or meant to be somewhat vague.
Anyway, I can see the connection between stoicism and positive disintegration. Both offer a framework for living with the struggles of life, working through them and coming out the other end a little stronger. ❤️
Thanks for sharing all these thoughts! I really appreciate how generous you are with your comments. I do want to share that I think interviews are so tricky. When Jessie uses the word "attitude" to describe why I'm having the experience I am, I wish I'd thought to offer a different word, because to me it's not just an attitude, it's a whole new orientation. This means that it's more than "coming out the other end a little stronger." Does this make any sense? When we reorient to Life's struggles and see them as opportunities for growth and learning, and when we give up our attempts to control Life and avoid Life's inevitable pain--we open ourselves up to a whole new way of Living. Frameworks like stoicism and TPD can certainly help to get us there. It's when we embody our understanding of those frameworks that we really get to experience the benefits. I can't help but recognize how many different ways humans have described these "dark nights of the soul" as initiations into radical transformation. Almost like it's built into our very nature...
Thanks for this opportunity to dig in even a little deeper!
Was thinking of you as I was reading Lisa's post. 🙂
I've often thought that a simple nature-nurture dichotomy -- a binary -- was only part of the picture, that we're all somewhat more than the sum of our parts, more than just our biological inheritance or what society has dictated to us. That that binary is anything but "exhaustive". Sort of like the binary of male and female not being exhaustive, that there are many members of many anisogamous species, including the human one, who are neither, who are sexless ... 😉🙂
Here we totally agree. :)
👍🙂
BTW, I see you read Singal-Minded but not sure if you have a subscription. Apparently I have 3 free ones to give out if you're interested and don't have one. Anyone else for that matter too.
Also, you might check out that thread with Ms. M as her post on Scientific American more or less precipitated our conversation on my Substack. I've just linked it there in case you wanted to weigh-in or add any qualifications ... 😉🙂:
https://twoplustwo.substack.com/p/224-vol-11-anti-women-men-children-human/comment/43016781
I do not have a subscription and would happily take a free one to Singal-Minded. Thanks. I read your exchange with Ms.M, who had pretty much the same goals as me and I do see your consistent answer now. Just use genitalia or DNA or some other markers instead, as appropriate. I agree. (I didn’t weigh in there as I don’t yet subscribe to that substack.)
Follow-up from my previous comment, my brief conversation with Ms. M on Goya's Sleep of Reason -- something that should be of particular interest to you, given your "searching for reason in an insane world" 🙂:
https://twoplustwo.substack.com/p/224-vol-1-hard-lessons-and-uncomfortable/comment/14799230
The painting had been used to start off this essay in American Affairs:
https://americanaffairsjournal.org/2023/03/how-to-understand-the-well-being-gap-between-liberals-and-conservatives/
Thanks for that. The article looks interesting, but long - so I will have to defer...
De nada, though I'll need your email address to complete the gift. I think you subscribe to my Substack and our list of subscribers provides those but I don't see one that I'd recognize as yours. As I subscribe to your Substack you can either email me directly or let me know the first part of yours here or elsewhere if you're subscribed. Though the gift is just for a month but still some useful subscriber benefits.
En passant, Ms. M's Substack is apparently free to subscribe to and well worth doing so -- many posts you'd probably find useful:
https://twoplustwo.substack.com/p/224-vol-2-we-need-to-talk-about-trans
https://twoplustwo.substack.com/p/why-are-so-many-children-declaring
https://twoplustwo.substack.com/p/i-identify-therefore-i-am-the-illusion
https://twoplustwo.substack.com/p/leave-them-kids-alone-transgender
Seem to recollect that she and I had discussed Goya's Sleep of Reason as she had linked to a post that featured his painting, although I can't find it at the moment:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sleep_of_Reason_Produces_Monsters
Kind of an apt summary of the problems that society is facing, your "just use genitalia or DNA" underlining the point and the causes.
I will check out Ms. M's substack. Seems quite up my ally.
I will email you directly.